NIOSH FORUM

It is currently Tue Oct 21, 2014 12:24 pm

All times are UTC + 8:45 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 19 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Method to calculate "Total Man-Hours Worked"
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 10:02 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2007 3:58 pm
Posts: 6
Hi to all Sifu,

This is actually for the compilation of the NADOPOD JKKP form 8.
In the calculation of Frequency Rate and Severity Rate, we need to determine the Total Man-HOurs Worked. THe company I'm now working is having the following system
Working day - MOn till Fri
WOrking hour - 8.30am to 12.30am, 1.30pm to 5.30pm
Total no. of staffs - 62

Is this way of calculation correct?
Total Man hours worked = 62 pax X 8hr X 20days
= 9920


Thanks

Poon


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Method to calculate "Total Man-Hours Worked"
PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 9:17 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Nov 05, 2007 2:02 pm
Posts: 79
Location: Kuala Lumpur
Im not any Sifu, just answering to your curiosity. I’ve been waiting someone “competent” which I believe more familiar with those forms and ever submitted to DOSH to answering you actually, (since I’m not competent SHO i.e. neither had an experience filling nor submitting any of those forms) but seems that they are kinda busy, perhaps.

Back to your mathematical equation, the answer shown is actually giving you the Total Manhours worked for a MONTH, whereas in NADOOPOD, the calculation are expected to accumulate your YEARLY performance. In other word, you have to multiply your “monthly” value by 12, and then only you’ll get the correct “denominator” for your fraction/formulae in order for you to calculate the Severity Rate as well as the Frequency Rate for both Occupational Accident and Occupational Poisoning & Disease in your JKKP 8 (IV).

i.e. 62 pax X 8hr X 20days X 12months = Total Manhours Worked for the Year of XXXX

Dearest Competent Person (SHO), correct me if i'm wrong. Takut Ajaran Sesat pulak.

_________________
Just Care,
Reza.

Image Image Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Method to calculate "Total Man-Hours Worked"
PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 10:19 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2007 3:58 pm
Posts: 6
Hi RezaHuzainie,

Thanks for the guidance.
Another question. Say for example
Working day - Mon till Fri
Working hour - 8.30am to 12.30am, 1.30pm to 5.30pm
Total no. of staffs - 62 pax
Total No of accident recorded/yr - 10
Total Workdays Lost/yr - 11

Total Man Hours Worked = 62 pax X 8 hrs X 20 days X 12 months
= 119040

Incident Rate
= No. of accidents (10)/Annual average of No. employees (62) X 1000
= 161.3

Frequency Rate
= No. of accidents (10)/ Total man-hours worked (119040) X 1,000,000
= 84.0

Frequency Rate
= Total workdays lost (11) / Total man-hours worked (119040) X 1,000,000
= 92.4

Based on those figure I got, what can I said with these figures:
Incident Rate=161.3
Frequency Rate=84.0
Frequency Rate=92.4

Are they high/low, good/bad?
Is it I will need to have the next coming year data to compare in order to know whether are there any improvement / getting worst?

For your info, the company I'm working in is a local (SMI) food flavour manufacturer. Therefore I don't think so I can find other similar industry to compare with as this business is quite a niche market and most of the players are located overseas.
Million thanks again

Poon


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Method to calculate "Total Man-Hours Worked"
PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 4:59 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Nov 05, 2007 2:02 pm
Posts: 79
Location: Kuala Lumpur
poontl wrote:
Are they high/low, good/bad?
Very subjective. Refer to the "Explanation 1" below.

poontl wrote:
Is it I will need to have the next coming year data to compare in order to know whether are there any improvement / getting worst?
Yes, this is what we called "individual performance benchmarking" over a defined period of time. In this case, it is a yearly performance statistical benchmarking, since the calculation used here is a "yearly-based" formula. Again, I repeat, this is to measure your own organization performance trending, any positive trending or negative, from statistical point of view, which is not for any comparison purposes with any other similar business capacity or disciplines.

poontl wrote:
For your info, the company I'm working in is a local (SMI) food flavour manufacturer.
Therefore I don't think so I can find other similar industry to compare with as this business is quite a niche market and most of the players are located overseas.
This will be done if you wish to benchmark your organization’s performance with any other similar business size, capacity or disciplines. Theoretically, yes, you can’t find your "competitor" here in this country. But practically, it doesn’t necessary have to be "food flavour manufacturer", dude. You may benchmark with any other food manufacturer which having the same process as yours, and if possible which having the similar number of workers as yours. If possible, which is not compulsory. Refer to the "Explanation 2" below.

Explanation 1:

The only party who can respond to your question on whether your performance is good or bad based from your calculated ratings using NADOOPOD’s formula is DOSH. Why? I’m sure they have done all the necessary "ratings" compilation for all business thread respectively, all organizational size respectively, etc. which will help them to come out with the "Mean", "Median", "Mode" and "Range" from the overall statistics given by you guys before end of January each year. Based from these findings, you may figure where your company stands among the similar business and size organizations as yours in Malaysia. Please don’t ask me how to get the data, I don’t know either, this is just from my own logic thinking, on "why you guys need to submit those data to them". That is why (if you noticed) there are 3 business-size categories indicated in the referred forms, i.e. B (25 Million and >151 workers), M (10-25 Million and 51-150 workers), and S (<10 Million and <50 workers). Remember, this is just my own logic thinking. Please refer to the nearest DOSH's office...hehe!!

Tips: Consider the same problem below, but I change the no of personnel from 62 to 620:

Working day - Mon till Fri
Working hour - 8.30am to 12.30am, 1.30pm to 5.30pm
Total no. of staffs - 620 pax
Total No of accident recorded/yr - 10
Total Workdays Lost/yr – 11

Total Man Hours Worked = 620 pax X 8 hrs X 20 days X 12 months
= 1,190,400

Incident Rate
= No. of accidents (10)/Annual average of No. employees (620) X 1000
= 16.13

Frequency Rate
= No. of accidents (10)/ Total man-hours worked (1,190,400) X 1,000,000
= 8.4

Frequency Rate - Poisonous/Occupational Disease
= Total workdays lost (11) / Total man-hours worked (1,190,400) X 1,000,000
= 9.24

Do you think it’s fair to your organization in doing such benchmarking?

Explanation 2:

If you want to benchmark among the similar business with your own sourced data (especially multinational organization), please consider:

1. The multipliers - "exposure hours". Ensure consistency in the multipliers used. Some organization ratings are based on an exposure of 200,000 hours, especially in the US. In the UK pulak, organisations typically use 100,000 (ILO pun pakai nih) whilst DOSH required ours to be on an exposure of 1,000,000 hours.

2. The "workdays" thingy. Some organization will count the workdays thingy such as lost workdays, restricted workdays, etc on a calendar day basis (including weekends and public holidays) whereas some organization counts on a working day basis only. NADOOPOD will counts on a working day basis similarly with OSHA (US) system and the American National Standard ANSI Z16.5-1998. Our major Oil and Gas player, Petronas, in the other hand, will calculate the Lost Workdays and Restricted Workdays on a calendar day basis, according to their PTS Manual.

3. The "exposure hours per day". Most of the time, even in our NADOOPOD, the exposure hours per day is based on 8 hours per day. But don’t be surprised, some 24 hours operated organization uses a 24 hours exposure time per day. For example, Armada Hess Limited, for their offshore personnel. I’m not talking about Bumi Armada or Carigali-Hess (CHOC) whatsoever. Some organization pula will include the exposure hours with the "scheduled" overtime macam Shell & Petronas.

4. The "number of persons employed" for manhours calculation – MAY or MAY NOT include part time workers, contractors, temporary workers, indon or bangla yg buat partime, etc.

Hopefully these “blurb” answering to your question, Sir.

_________________
Just Care,
Reza.

Image Image Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Method to calculate "Total Man-Hours Worked"
PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 5:59 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2007 3:58 pm
Posts: 6
Hi bro rezahuzainie,

Thank you very much for the kind detail explanation.
FYI, actually I have already sent the similar question which I posted here to 2 DOSH Officers, En Rahim and Pn Jalidah.

Do you think the 2 DOSH Officers whom I emailed them about 2 days back will have the time to reply my email or not?
Hopefully I will get some other answers from them. I will post their reply here if they happen to reply my enquiry.

Thanks

Poon


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Method to calculate "Total Man-Hours Worked"
PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 8:53 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Nov 05, 2007 2:02 pm
Posts: 79
Location: Kuala Lumpur
Hehe, "no comment". They are busy, perhaps. Not like me, always mengular. (Please...my job scope requires me to do a lot of research which was why I'm always here entertaining you guys while browsing the net seeking for an info - ya rite...haha!!).

Anyway, yeah...please post 'em here, if you dont mind sharing with us here. Thanks in advance, Sir.

_________________
Just Care,
Reza.

Image Image Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Method to calculate "Total Man-Hours Worked"
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 8:53 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Nov 05, 2007 2:02 pm
Posts: 79
Location: Kuala Lumpur
Guys, there are some questions from Mr/Ms ccpling (which posted to me via PM).

ccpling wrote:
If an accident involved 2 injured persons, does it consider one case or 2 cases in NADOPOD number of cases ?
ccpling wrote:
I gave examples as below :

If there is one incident involved more than 1 victim, eg 2 victims :
1. Is it considered 1 or 2 cases in NADOPOD report ? (Fill in 1 case as a whole in JKKP(II) or JKKP (III) or need to put down as 2 cases in JKKP(II) or JKKP (III)
2. Do we need to list down all victims involved in JKKP I (1st sheet) ?
3. Example : If there is a food poisoning case in inhouse canteen, is it considered occupational poisoning ? The number of victims might be more than 10 persons. If it needs to be filled in, how to fill in ?
I don’t have the exact answer (from NADOOPOD’s point of view) since never had any chance completing those forms.

Dearest competent SHO, please help him out. I’m interested to know as well. Thanks.

_________________
Just Care,
Reza.

Image Image Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Method to calculate "Total Man-Hours Worked"
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 9:07 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Nov 05, 2007 2:02 pm
Posts: 79
Location: Kuala Lumpur
rezahuzainie wrote:
2. The "workdays" thingy. Some organization will count the workdays thingy such as lost workdays, restricted workdays, etc on a calendar day basis (including weekends and public holidays) whereas some organization counts on a working day basis only. NADOOPOD will counts on a working day basis similarly with OSHA (US) system and the American National Standard ANSI Z16.5-1998. Our major Oil and Gas player, Petronas, in the other hand, will calculate the Lost Workdays and Restricted Workdays on a calendar day basis, according to their PTS Manual.
Pembetulan:

Plucked out from the NADOOPOD Regulation, under Interpretation clause: "lost-time" means lost days counted from and including the day following the day of the accident measured in calender days. Thus, from this interpretation, I am assuming that the "workdays-thingy" will include weekends and public holidays. I'm not so sure, any comment?

_________________
Just Care,
Reza.

Image Image Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Method to calculate "Total Man-Hours Worked"
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 11:10 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2007 3:58 pm
Posts: 6
Hi Rezahuzainie,

"[quote] "measured in calender days" [/quote)

I agree with you. Calender days are including Sat, Sun & Public holiday as well.

Poon


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Method to calculate "Total Man-Hours Worked"
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 11:46 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:15 am
Posts: 16
Location: Shah Alam & KLCC
rezahuzainie wrote:
Guys, there are some questions from Mr/Ms ccpling (which posted to me via PM).

ccpling wrote:
If an accident involved 2 injured persons, does it consider one case or 2 cases in NADOPOD number of cases ?
ccpling wrote:
I gave examples as below :

If there is one incident involved more than 1 victim, eg 2 victims :
1. Is it considered 1 or 2 cases in NADOPOD report ? (Fill in 1 case as a whole in JKKP(II) or JKKP (III) or need to put down as 2 cases in JKKP(II) or JKKP (III)
2. Do we need to list down all victims involved in JKKP I (1st sheet) ?
3. Example : If there is a food poisoning case in inhouse canteen, is it considered occupational poisoning ? The number of victims might be more than 10 persons. If it needs to be filled in, how to fill in ?
I don’t have the exact answer (from NADOOPOD’s point of view) since never had any chance completing those forms.

Dearest competent SHO, please help him out. I’m interested to know as well. Thanks.


Reza....
From Nadoopod point of view, in form JKKP 8 (I) we will fill in da workers namelist (victims). In which if there is any case(s) an incident/accident happened that involved more that 1 victims thus you need to fill the form with each victim's name accordingly. Thus the cases amount will be calculated as the amount of the victims.

rezahuzainie wrote:
Pembetulan:

Plucked out from the NADOOPOD Regulation, under Interpretation clause: "lost-time" means lost days counted from and including the day following the day of the accident measured in calender days. Thus, from this interpretation, I am assuming that the "workdays-thingy" will include weekends and public holidays. I'm not so sure, any comment?


Ok....yg ini plak agak subjective...since pernah diajukan kat 1-2 DOSH officer, since a few cases being brought up to them for their point of view.
For example:
Ali normal working day is from Mon - Fri. He had an Occ. accident on Thursday morning. Got MC for 2 days (Thursday & Friday). On following Monday he got another MC (must be related to the accident injuries) & only continue working the following day (Tuesday). So how many lost-time injury???
Answer: LTI = 5 days (Thursday - Monday) Although MC = 3 days
Sat. & Sun. included since he still not recover from the injuries.


Let say Ali resume his work on Monday??? So how many lost-time injury???
Ini yang jadik isu, dier MC 2 days (khamis & jumaat) tapi hari sabtu & ahad tue dier dah recover dari injury ke belum??? so tak der bukti yg mengatakan dier still sakit during sabtu & ahad tue

So...aper yg saya practickan, saya indicate no of MC jer dlm nadoopod as LTI. Since pihak DOSH pun takder lak highlightkan which one should be followed although its clearly stated in OSHA.

This as opinion & been practice by my side. Some one out there want to add or correct me please do so....in a learning process.

_________________
" Get smart!! Use safety from the start "


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 19 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC + 8:45 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group